Maine Scallop Advisory Council Meeting Minutes
May 21, 2009
at the Natural Resource Service Center,
Conference Room 106 in Hallowell
DRAFT NOTES
NOTE: These notes are NOT YET APPROVED by the SAC
Attendance:
SAC members: Terry Gray, Terence Kenney, George Freeman, Jon Grabowski, Dana Morse, Dana Temple, Ernest Kelley, Tim Harper, Barry Huckins
DMR Staff: Togue Brawn, Linda Mercer, Kevin Kelly, Jon Cornish, Alan Talbot, David Etnier.
Audience: Jimmy Wotton, Travis Fogg, Mike Keating, Arthur Alley, Maurice Alley, Tracey Sawtelle, Howard Robbins, Leo Murray, Scott Emery, Brian Soper, Brian Preney, Bill Sutter.
Dana reviewed the agenda. He explained that public comment would be limited and would occur after the Cobscook Bay presentation, prior to the SAC vote on closure recommendations. He reminded everyone that this is “our” recommendation, that they should keep in mind this is not the final word. The SAC will present this to DMR, who will develop the rule that will then then will go out to public hearing.
Introductions were given.
Barry motioned and Dana Morse seconded the approval of the minutes. Minutes were accepted unanimously.
Closure recommendations
• Togue – gave background on how we got to this point. Reviewed Dvora Hart’s recommendations, asked everyone to keep in mind the ultimate goal is to bring back scallops, please keep this in mind as you develop your proposal.
• Terrence – asked for clarification on Casco Bay – the blue area is DMR proposal? Either one is acceptable to DMR, not both. Terence would rather see the purple one closed than the one that is up inside.
• George – would rather have purple for wrong reasons – more scallops in blue area. George doesn’t think the scallop levels are the same as the 2005 survey.
• Terence: The purple one has more small scallops and he thinks they would come back faster.
• Brian Soper agrees with Terence
• George – Why are the areas so large? Going into this blind. No plan for reopening. Need to have a plan before we close areas.
• Dana T – We need to limit fishing pressure. Sure we will have to do this in these areas when they reopen. To have a viable fishery, we need to move forward.
• Togue – We don’t know what area management means yet for the scallop fishery – some say they’re in favor of it, but others are afraid of it, and we can’t move forward until we figure out what form, if any, will work in scallops. We’ve spent a long time talking about which management options might work. This is what we have come up with.
Damariscotta Area
• Dana M – The Damariscotta River vs. Sheepscot is a thorny issue. Personally feels that closure of all one river is less artful way to go. Prefers to see parts of one of those rivers closed – some of proposals from the meetings could allow access and get same conservation by closing pieces of each. Some fishermen fish exclusively in one river. Some of the discussion in the next area up influenced the Damariscotta R. discussion but should be kept separate.
• Bill Sutter- Sheepscot. No different now that 40 years ago. Small scallops there. Not economically viable. Why close it? Create gear conflicts because Damariscotta River is closed in Dec. Heard that going to close urchins in scallops areas – is this true?
• Togue – The only area the Department has discussed closing to both urchins and scallops is part of Cobscook.
• George – There are diseased scallops in the upper DR. Are we going to let these diseased scallops propagate and spread?
• Brian Preney – No such thing as a good closure. You don’t know what is going to happen. No trust in where we are heading. Trashing what people offered. Never heard of Dvora Hart. We need to stop and develop a plan. Know what we are going to do before we close it.
• David Etnier – need to move along and focus on Sheepscot and DR. Let’s move forward.
• Mike Keating – encourage SAC to leave some portion of the rivers open so people don’t have to travel so far.
• Andy would like to see some accommodation. It is a small number of fishermen who fish here.
• Time spent looking at the chart: just south of the gut in south Bristol, across to Boothbay, Thrumbcap, up the Sheepscot R. – doesn’t close off both rivers. John’s Bay will be left open. All of Linekin Bay will be closed. Andy likes it, Dana defers to people who fish there. MP – tweak a couple spots. Terrence – is this going to affect shrimp dragging? No. Togue noted the area drawn in the Sheepscot will be changed by the Dept. to include the eastern shore of Southport Island, per survey data.
Lost conversation on Sheepscot/Damariscotta and western Pen Bay areas
Stonington –
• Terry – OK with it. The fishing in Eggemogin Reach hasn't been viable for 15 years but the southern half of the closure includes some good ground.
• Andy – Stonington group worked hard on their proposal and thinks we need to stay as close to it as possible. What about Blue Hill Harbor – used to be a good area. Gets a lot of recruitment (Kevin saw seed in the last survey). Noted several people at the Ellsworth meeting wanted it closed. Discussion about adding it. Yes
Somes Sound/Bass Harbor
• Andy- let’s do the purple area – likely to be more successful. Large parts of blue area have no scallops. Line from the west side of Somes Sound and Otter Cliffs out.
Eastern areas:
• Jr. proposed reconfiguring areas off Jonesport and Machias Bay. Half of Machias Bay is closed. Little Machias Bay is now closed.
• Gouldsboro – people proposed closing upper Bay. DMR proposes closing to the mouth of the bay. Nobody is fishing there.
Cobscook Bay proposal – Leo Murray
Wants DMR closure as an area management experiment. Wants local boats to have special access to rotational program. Wants St. Croix and outer area off Lubec split into two areas each, one is open and one closed. Don’t want to entirely exclude people from fishery. Maybe a split season – Cobscook could have the first half. Come up with an endorsement – use $$ to do own assessments with our scientists.
David – want to work with Cobscook to develop rotational management. Sen. Raye’s bill has been carried over to next January. Probably start with Cobscook to figure out how to re-open. Will need Raye’s bill to limit entry, etc.
Leo – doesn’t like the clause about continuing the closure if there is no plan. Discussion amongst the SAC, they also don’t like that.
DMR agrees to taking out the clause.
There will be opposition to closing an area to both urchins and scallops but the CBFA will support proposal.
Discussion between Junior and Leo – Junior said Cobscook was not the first to put drag size and other management measures into place. Leo concurred.
Andy – not sure what Leo’s proposal is with what is on the table. Are we looking to close Dennys and Whiting Bays for 3 years?
Togue – St. Croix will be added in to larger suite of closures for 3 years. The 2-yr closure of Whiting/Dennys will be a separate rule making.
Leo – We proposed an outside closure but DMR didn’t like it.
Andy – sounds like Cobscook has been working with the DMR to give them exclusive rights down the road.
David- No exclusivity for fishermen in any area. Committed to working on re-opening plans.
Barry – would rather see a 3-year rotational: Whiting and Dennys is 100% of his fishing but can deal with it. Would like to divide the Bay in thirds. Leighton R., South Bay/East River, North Lubec Bay to Int’l Bridge. Close each area for one year. Season is shorter so won’t be putting so much pressure on.
What about urchins? Andy asked – SAC doesn’t have have oversight of urchins.
Togue – We will have to bring this up to the urchin council. This proposal will go out to public hearing.
SAC agrees that they will vote on the Cobscook issue with regard only to scallops.
Togue – explains it’s her understanding that Cobscook will not support proposal unless it is closed to urchins as well as scallops. Asks Leo to confirm, he does.
Andy asks Leo what his alternative is, he says alternate proposal is to shut the whole bay down.
Dana doesn’t think we should vote on urchins. Terence and Jonathan agreed. Other fisheries will put forth proposals to close scallops.
Public Comment
Brian Soper – I feel that this nothing but blackmail from the state. So few that know so little are controlling so many. 4” ring size and shorter season are in place. Already gave up small areas that could be closed for an indefinite amount of time. Don’t know how to re-open. Will you put a lottery on it or something? Scallops are going to come back thickly. Casco Bay area is too large. Give us 2 years with ring size and shorter season.
Bill Sutter – will need to talk about effort control and access allocation and area management. This follows the federal model. That led to 75% reduction in access. Not going to be able to do this with 1000 scallop licenses. Dana – has already said this – maybe can only support 250 fishermen.
Sherm – We don’t have to follow federal path. Have a lot more flexibility and options.
Brian Preney – The tone is a lot different than prior meeting minutes, including Cobscook. Is hearing needed for area management plans? DMR knows exactly what it wants closed. Didn’t want to draw lines – wanted to preserve fishing areas. If DMR doesn’t get it today, will get it later.
Mike - Pen Bay closure – don’t close off any community totally to fishing grounds (no more than 50%.
Motion to approve closures with a sunset clause at the end of 3 years. Andy moves as areas have been amended at this meeting with sunset in Dec. 2012. Barry seconded.
7 in favor
Discussion ensued whether to include urchins in the Cobscook proposal or not. Could vote for just scallops, or could vote for both but encourage the Dept. to work with the SUZC. Togue notes that Bill Sutter (chair of the SUZC) is in the room. Dana T asks him to speak. Bill notes that he would not be opposed to a pilot program in area management in Cobscook.
Andy: Endorse the Cobscook proposal and encourage them to work with the SUZC
Tim 2nd
8 in favor
1 against
One abstention
Season Length
DMR recommends 70 days.
Jr.: 4 days a week from Dec. 1st thru Mar. 31st = 78 days, Tues-Fri. Take out 8 days:
Day before Christmas and Christmas Day, New Year’s Eve and New Year’s and Feb vacation.
Andy – Would be happy to let rec. people to go right through the season.
Alan – Doesn’t like separate seasons for recreational and commercial – why can’t you pick one weekend day?
Andy – Already have a recreational precedent in worming. If have rec. license, say they can’t get a commercial license (can’t do both– would need statute change). Andy has both licenses – can use someone with a recreational license to tend if he’s fishing with his recreational license. Doesn’t want to take away options for rec. license holders if they can’t fish on the weekends as well as those who run charters.
Togue - DMR would prefer one season for both. Can recommend two different seasons but we probably won’t support it – at least for this season.
George – How about a call-in program?
Togue – Not feasible, at least not for this season.
Does Weds-Sat work?
Maurice – Urchiners will be working all week.
How about M,T, W, S
Arthur – liked split season better than 4 days a week. Winter storms can take away days.
Dana – we received a lot comments opposed to split season.
Togue – I’ve heard many comments opposed to a split season.
Brian Soper – liked split season. End of Jan. and Feb. are bad weather. Rec divers will take what they want to take.
Maurice – for the 6 weeks we were shut down, urchin draggers took scallops (Machias).
Andy – guys in his area do not support split season – solves rec issues only.
Start season later and run right to end. Jan 21 thru March 31st
Dana - take off Sundays with Mar 31 end.
Maurice – start Dec. 15 and 4 days/week
Terence – too hard for those selling to dealers – wants straight season
Jan 9-Mar. 31 w/ Sundays off
Dana M. – a year ago discussion in Ellsworth about safety – when you reduce number of days.
Tim – pushing it to January is a weather problem.
Not sure weather is a big problem –
Voted 6-4 in favor of split season, but there was much disagreement – SAC would like a lot of public comment on the season
Barry motioned to adjourn, 2nd by Tim.
